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Subject Author Date
Quicken 2008: Tags vs. Classes David A. Lessnau 08-31-2007
Posted by David A. Lessnau on August 31, 2007, 8:51 am
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In Quicken 2008, they've replaced Classes with Tags. Personally, with only
a very limited amount of time spent with the program, I don't see the point
in the change: they seem to work about the same. One problem I have with
Tags is that there's a Tag field in the Register instead of the Class just
being appended to the Category (separated by a slash). That's no problem
when you only have one Category. But, if you have splits (which almost all
my transactions do), then along with the Category field saying "--Split--,"
you now also have a Tag field saying "--Split--" (and the Tag field's split
isn't enterable or editable -- that's done from within the Category split).
All it seems to do is clutter up the Register. It's possible to remove the
Tag field from the Register entirely through the Options area, but then you
can't see how you've Tagged (Classified) your transactions. I'd say that
leaving the Tag field in split transactions entirely empty would have been a
better solution for Intuit to use.

Dave


Posted by Andrew on August 31, 2007, 9:05 am
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David A. Lessnau wrote:
> In Quicken 2008, they've replaced Classes with Tags. ... Dave

David - and any others : What was the 'problem' they were trying to solve?
Maybe I am missing the point (I do know from one of another posts one can
have multiple 'tags' per transaction), but I'm confused. Does the tags
"enhancement" provide meaningful improvement in organizing or tracking ?

Another question - Intuit is advertising an enhancement of "You can also add
extra details to any expense to help jog your memory -- i.e., the specific
restaurant for a dining expense or the trip destination for an airline
ticket." - didn't the NOTES facility already allow you to do that? I use a
GREEN Flag to indicate that there is a note associated with that
transaction, and now I fear that I will have to change all those to this
'new' facility, or not use it to avoid mix and matching. What's the
difference? (I really don't want to hear it's just a different way of
doing the same thing without additional benefits).

I'm somewhat concerned that they did not provide any real meaningful updates
to this release - and this is the first time since using one of the original
DOS versions of Quicken since the mid 1980s that I don't see any
enhancements worth going to, and in fact, it's regressing features that I've
used in the past without any improvements in what is being offered as a
replacement as far as I can see from afar.

This is typical of software that have matured to a point that new features
being added provide additional 'bloatware' without redeeming benefits.
Happens quite often with software that has releases over time.

Please someone tell me I'm wrong (with details) and that 2008 is worth
moving up to from 2007 versions!
--
-------------------------------------------------------------
Regards -

- Andrew



Posted by David A. Lessnau on August 31, 2007, 11:16 am
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I don't really know what was wrong with the old Classes method that they had
to change it to Tags. I used Classes only very lightly. But, even though
Intuit's Help file says "tags are an improved and expanded version of
classes," I don't see any difference except the UI. Maybe someone who used
Classes more than I did can see the difference.

Regarding Notes, I didn't even know there was such a facility. Of course, I
came from Quicken 2005, so maybe (if I'm not to be embarrassed), Notes
weren't implemented there. Anyway, Notes and Flags are still in Quicken
2008.

As for "meaningful updates," I only upgraded because 1) Quicken 2005 was
sunsetting, and 2) I was having continual "stopped responding" problems with
Quicken 2005 under Vista Ultimate (32-bit). I actually had to uninstall '05
from Vista and run it under an XP Virtual Machine. Workable, but slow and
cumbersome. With 2008, I had one "stopped responding" problem shortly after
I installed it (when I first hit the My Savings Plan button for the first
time). Since then, everything's run fine. However, my biggest gripe with
Intuit's upgrade dance is that they always seem to JUST change the UI and
leave all the long-standing bugs and deficiencies in place. From what I
can see with this release, the UI isn't TOO different from previous versions
(which is good). I haven't used it long enough to see if the actual
"ledger" side of the program works any better or worse. The official
Quicken Community board does have some threads running saying that some high
visibility bugs haven't been fixed (screen flicker and net worth values come
to mind).

Dave




> David A. Lessnau wrote:
>> In Quicken 2008, they've replaced Classes with Tags. ... Dave
>
> David - and any others : What was the 'problem' they were trying to solve?
> Maybe I am missing the point (I do know from one of another posts one can
> have multiple 'tags' per transaction), but I'm confused. Does the tags
> "enhancement" provide meaningful improvement in organizing or tracking ?
>
> Another question - Intuit is advertising an enhancement of "You can also
> add extra details to any expense to help jog your memory -- i.e., the
> specific restaurant for a dining expense or the trip destination for an
> airline ticket." - didn't the NOTES facility already allow you to do that?
> I use a GREEN Flag to indicate that there is a note associated with that
> transaction, and now I fear that I will have to change all those to this
> 'new' facility, or not use it to avoid mix and matching. What's the
> difference? (I really don't want to hear it's just a different way of
> doing the same thing without additional benefits).
>
> I'm somewhat concerned that they did not provide any real meaningful
> updates to this release - and this is the first time since using one of
> the original DOS versions of Quicken since the mid 1980s that I don't see
> any enhancements worth going to, and in fact, it's regressing features
> that I've used in the past without any improvements in what is being
> offered as a replacement as far as I can see from afar.
>
> This is typical of software that have matured to a point that new features
> being added provide additional 'bloatware' without redeeming benefits.
> Happens quite often with software that has releases over time.
>
> Please someone tell me I'm wrong (with details) and that 2008 is worth
> moving up to from 2007 versions!
> --
> -------------------------------------------------------------
> Regards -
>
> - Andrew
>


Posted by Oilcan on August 31, 2007, 10:21 pm
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I found classes to be a pain as far as data entry went. Tried them and
reverted back to creating categories. The big problem is the classes where
off my radar...meaning that I couldn't see them (long category names) and
they "would stick" when I changed categories. I ended up spending too much
time correcting transactions because of this.

I may resume using tags because it is a separate data entry field that is
more visible. Have not had time to experiment with this yet.

I don't think there is anything major in this upgrade by my system seems my
stable then Q2007 Premier running under Vista Ultimate. I haven't had a
crash in one step update and my Bank of America Express Web Connect has
"magically" started working - meaning that it now is downloading transaction
detail in addition to Account Balances.

>I don't really know what was wrong with the old Classes method that they
>had to change it to Tags. I used Classes only very lightly. But, even
>though Intuit's Help file says "tags are an improved and expanded version
>of classes," I don't see any difference except the UI. Maybe someone who
>used Classes more than I did can see the difference.
>
> Regarding Notes, I didn't even know there was such a facility. Of course,
> I came from Quicken 2005, so maybe (if I'm not to be embarrassed), Notes
> weren't implemented there. Anyway, Notes and Flags are still in Quicken
> 2008.
>
> As for "meaningful updates," I only upgraded because 1) Quicken 2005 was
> sunsetting, and 2) I was having continual "stopped responding" problems
> with Quicken 2005 under Vista Ultimate (32-bit). I actually had to
> uninstall '05 from Vista and run it under an XP Virtual Machine.
> Workable, but slow and cumbersome. With 2008, I had one "stopped
> responding" problem shortly after I installed it (when I first hit the My
> Savings Plan button for the first time). Since then, everything's run
> fine. However, my biggest gripe with Intuit's upgrade dance is that they
> always seem to JUST change the UI and leave all the long-standing bugs and
> deficiencies in place. From what I can see with this release, the UI
> isn't TOO different from previous versions (which is good). I haven't
> used it long enough to see if the actual "ledger" side of the program
> works any better or worse. The official Quicken Community board does have
> some threads running saying that some high visibility bugs haven't been
> fixed (screen flicker and net worth values come to mind).
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
>> David A. Lessnau wrote:
>>> In Quicken 2008, they've replaced Classes with Tags. ... Dave
>>
>> David - and any others : What was the 'problem' they were trying to
>> solve? Maybe I am missing the point (I do know from one of another posts
>> one can have multiple 'tags' per transaction), but I'm confused. Does
>> the tags "enhancement" provide meaningful improvement in organizing or
>> tracking ?
>>
>> Another question - Intuit is advertising an enhancement of "You can also
>> add extra details to any expense to help jog your memory -- i.e., the
>> specific restaurant for a dining expense or the trip destination for an
>> airline ticket." - didn't the NOTES facility already allow you to do
>> that? I use a GREEN Flag to indicate that there is a note associated with
>> that transaction, and now I fear that I will have to change all those to
>> this 'new' facility, or not use it to avoid mix and matching. What's the
>> difference? (I really don't want to hear it's just a different way of
>> doing the same thing without additional benefits).
>>
>> I'm somewhat concerned that they did not provide any real meaningful
>> updates to this release - and this is the first time since using one of
>> the original DOS versions of Quicken since the mid 1980s that I don't see
>> any enhancements worth going to, and in fact, it's regressing features
>> that I've used in the past without any improvements in what is being
>> offered as a replacement as far as I can see from afar.
>>
>> This is typical of software that have matured to a point that new
>> features being added provide additional 'bloatware' without redeeming
>> benefits. Happens quite often with software that has releases over time.
>>
>> Please someone tell me I'm wrong (with details) and that 2008 is worth
>> moving up to from 2007 versions!
>> --
>> -------------------------------------------------------------
>> Regards -
>>
>> - Andrew
>>
>


Posted by Bernie on September 1, 2007, 1:11 pm
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I wasn't aware of the Notes or Flags either. I've used Quicken for a
LONG time, currently Q2007. The Memo filed has always been sufficient
for me rather than Notes, and the Memo field can be searched. Now that
I know about them the Flag may be useful.

In all these years I've never needed Classes and simply found them to
add a layer of complexity to the way we use Quicken. For categories
where it matters I have something like Clothes:Mine and Clothes:Wife
which is very easy to understand, enter and report on. For business
perhaps I'm fortunate but I've always used separate checking and/or
credit cards and even if there was any intermingling, categories were
completely sufficient.

Bernie

On 8/31/2007 10:16 AM, David A. Lessnau wrote:
> I don't really know what was wrong with the old Classes method that they
> had to change it to Tags. I used Classes only very lightly. But, even
> though Intuit's Help file says "tags are an improved and expanded
> version of classes," I don't see any difference except the UI. Maybe
> someone who used Classes more than I did can see the difference.
>
> Regarding Notes, I didn't even know there was such a facility. Of
> course, I came from Quicken 2005, so maybe (if I'm not to be
> embarrassed), Notes weren't implemented there. Anyway, Notes and Flags
> are still in Quicken 2008.
>
> As for "meaningful updates," I only upgraded because 1) Quicken 2005 was
> sunsetting, and 2) I was having continual "stopped responding" problems
> with Quicken 2005 under Vista Ultimate (32-bit). I actually had to
> uninstall '05 from Vista and run it under an XP Virtual Machine.
> Workable, but slow and cumbersome. With 2008, I had one "stopped
> responding" problem shortly after I installed it (when I first hit the
> My Savings Plan button for the first time). Since then, everything's
> run fine. However, my biggest gripe with Intuit's upgrade dance is that
> they always seem to JUST change the UI and leave all the long-standing
> bugs and deficiencies in place. From what I can see with this release,
> the UI isn't TOO different from previous versions (which is good). I
> haven't used it long enough to see if the actual "ledger" side of the
> program works any better or worse. The official Quicken Community board
> does have some threads running saying that some high visibility bugs
> haven't been fixed (screen flicker and net worth values come to mind).
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
>> David A. Lessnau wrote:
>>> In Quicken 2008, they've replaced Classes with Tags. ... Dave
>>
>> David - and any others : What was the 'problem' they were trying to
>> solve? Maybe I am missing the point (I do know from one of another
>> posts one can have multiple 'tags' per transaction), but I'm
>> confused. Does the tags "enhancement" provide meaningful improvement
>> in organizing or tracking ?
>>
>> Another question - Intuit is advertising an enhancement of "You can
>> also add extra details to any expense to help jog your memory -- i.e.,
>> the specific restaurant for a dining expense or the trip destination
>> for an airline ticket." - didn't the NOTES facility already allow you
>> to do that? I use a GREEN Flag to indicate that there is a note
>> associated with that transaction, and now I fear that I will have to
>> change all those to this 'new' facility, or not use it to avoid mix
>> and matching. What's the difference? (I really don't want to hear
>> it's just a different way of doing the same thing without additional
>> benefits).
>>
>> I'm somewhat concerned that they did not provide any real meaningful
>> updates to this release - and this is the first time since using one
>> of the original DOS versions of Quicken since the mid 1980s that I
>> don't see any enhancements worth going to, and in fact, it's
>> regressing features that I've used in the past without any
>> improvements in what is being offered as a replacement as far as I can
>> see from afar.
>>
>> This is typical of software that have matured to a point that new
>> features being added provide additional 'bloatware' without redeeming
>> benefits. Happens quite often with software that has releases over time.
>>
>> Please someone tell me I'm wrong (with details) and that 2008 is worth
>> moving up to from 2007 versions!
>> --
>> -------------------------------------------------------------
>> Regards -
>>
>> - Andrew
>>
>

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