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Subject Author Date
Year-end archiving PatJennings 12-30-2006
Posted by PatJennings on December 30, 2006, 1:13 pm
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I have never performed Year-end archiving of my Quicken data. I am unclear
as which data will carry forward and which will not. That's followed by how
do I access data that is not carried forward. From the help topic: "Archive
your data file if you want to continue using an unchanged version of your
current data file, and also create and store a separate file with just last
year's transactions." Since I have never archived, will Quicken now create
separate archive files of each year's data, or will it create one file of
all data excepting the rule in the quote?
I am raising this question because I have been told that files will corrupt
after several years of use. My file goes way back, perhaps 10 or more
years. So, I am concerned that something drastic is just around the corner.
I backup my file habitually. Are the backed up files subject to corruption,
too? What can be done if a file corrupts? My file has been validated and
super validated recently.
Scratching my head and sitting on pins and needles,
Pat



Posted by R. C. White on December 31, 2006, 2:55 pm
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Hi, Pat.

This is one of the most-often-discussed issues in this newsgroup, especially
around the end of each year.

The short answer is that most of us agree that backups are great, but
archiving is not needed and will reduce the usefulness of Quicken.

Backups, especially at "milestone" points, such as the end of each year, are
excellent ideas. In addition to the regular weekly backups which Quicken
makes automatically, plus the "manual" backups that Q reminds us to do
frequently, it is a great idea to have a backup of your data as of last
year-end, and that it is on removable media of some kind that can be stored
separately from your computer in case of fire, theft or other disaster.

But most of us see little good in removing historic data from our Quicken
data fileset. Yes, it makes the file smaller so that it takes up less disk
space. Many feel that it makes Q load faster, but nobody has ever proven
that, so far as I know, or even quantified it here. We often discuss the
size of our various Q data filesets, and many are larger and go back further
than yours. I've been using Quicken since 1990 and my fileset (the .qdf
plus .idx, .qph and 4 others) totals just over 30 MB. On a 120 GB hard
drive, even multiple backups of that size are not a great burden. Others
have reported larger files than that without any problems in loading or
using Quicken.

The beauty of this is that I can load Q2007 Basic and get a report of my
income and/or expenses for 1992 or 2002 as easily and quickly as for 2006.
If I need to recall when I bought that computer printer that went bad, to
see if it is out of warranty, it takes me only seconds. I don't have to
recall which year it might have happened, then find that year's archive,
load it, read it -- and then go look for the years before and after until I
find the right one. (And trying to find a 5.25" floppy disk drive to read
my old 1990 archive?)

> I am raising this question because I have been told that files will
> corrupt after several years of use.

Yes, we often hear that users "have been told" this, anonymously, of course,
but our own experience tells us otherwise. Yes, corruption was certainly a
problem a dozen years ago. Floppy diskettes were notorious and early 20 MB
hard drives were not much better. I still click Backup several times in
each Quicken session, a habit that goes back to the time when spontaneous
resets and other computer glitches left me looking at a rebooting computer
and having to re-enter an hour's work, not just in Q but in Word and any
other application I might have been using. Today's computers, though,
including the hard drives (and the NTFS file system) are so reliable that
such a situation rarely occurs. File corruption is not inevitable, though,
and like anything else, the likelihood increases with time and use. That's
why we keep the several levels of backup mentioned above. But I doubt that
archiving would provide any additional security against corruption.

When you have time, Pat, review the archives of this newsgroup and you will
see this question raised and answered many times.

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(Retired. No longer licensed to practice public accounting.)
rc@grandecom.net
Microsoft Windows MVP
(Currently running Vista Ultimate x64)

>I have never performed Year-end archiving of my Quicken data. I am unclear
>as which data will carry forward and which will not. That's followed by how
>do I access data that is not carried forward. From the help topic: "Archive
>your data file if you want to continue using an unchanged version of your
>current data file, and also create and store a separate file with just last
>year's transactions." Since I have never archived, will Quicken now create
>separate archive files of each year's data, or will it create one file of
>all data excepting the rule in the quote?
> I am raising this question because I have been told that files will
> corrupt after several years of use. My file goes way back, perhaps 10 or
> more years. So, I am concerned that something drastic is just around the
> corner. I backup my file habitually. Are the backed up files subject to
> corruption, too? What can be done if a file corrupts? My file has been
> validated and super validated recently.
> Scratching my head and sitting on pins and needles,
> Pat


Posted by PatJennings on January 2, 2007, 7:12 am
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Thanks RC for a very informative response.

Perhaps you can answer this question. How does one know that a file is
corrupted? After several hours of work by a skilled and gifted support
agent at Schwab, he said that my file is corrupt. I begged to differ with
him because the resolution of my problem did not set well with me. After
much deliberation, I went back to one of my backup files and began
replicating in it the changes he had made. The file seems to work well.
Thanks,
Pat
> Hi, Pat.
>
> This is one of the most-often-discussed issues in this newsgroup,
> especially around the end of each year.
>
> The short answer is that most of us agree that backups are great, but
> archiving is not needed and will reduce the usefulness of Quicken.
>
> Backups, especially at "milestone" points, such as the end of each year,
> are excellent ideas. In addition to the regular weekly backups which
> Quicken makes automatically, plus the "manual" backups that Q reminds us
> to do frequently, it is a great idea to have a backup of your data as of
> last year-end, and that it is on removable media of some kind that can be
> stored separately from your computer in case of fire, theft or other
> disaster.
>
> But most of us see little good in removing historic data from our Quicken
> data fileset. Yes, it makes the file smaller so that it takes up less
> disk space. Many feel that it makes Q load faster, but nobody has ever
> proven that, so far as I know, or even quantified it here. We often
> discuss the size of our various Q data filesets, and many are larger and
> go back further than yours. I've been using Quicken since 1990 and my
> fileset (the .qdf plus .idx, .qph and 4 others) totals just over 30 MB.
> On a 120 GB hard drive, even multiple backups of that size are not a great
> burden. Others have reported larger files than that without any problems
> in loading or using Quicken.
>
> The beauty of this is that I can load Q2007 Basic and get a report of my
> income and/or expenses for 1992 or 2002 as easily and quickly as for 2006.
> If I need to recall when I bought that computer printer that went bad, to
> see if it is out of warranty, it takes me only seconds. I don't have to
> recall which year it might have happened, then find that year's archive,
> load it, read it -- and then go look for the years before and after until
> I find the right one. (And trying to find a 5.25" floppy disk drive to
> read my old 1990 archive?)
>
>> I am raising this question because I have been told that files will
>> corrupt after several years of use.
>
> Yes, we often hear that users "have been told" this, anonymously, of
> course, but our own experience tells us otherwise. Yes, corruption was
> certainly a problem a dozen years ago. Floppy diskettes were notorious
> and early 20 MB hard drives were not much better. I still click Backup
> several times in each Quicken session, a habit that goes back to the time
> when spontaneous resets and other computer glitches left me looking at a
> rebooting computer and having to re-enter an hour's work, not just in Q
> but in Word and any other application I might have been using. Today's
> computers, though, including the hard drives (and the NTFS file system)
> are so reliable that such a situation rarely occurs. File corruption is
> not inevitable, though, and like anything else, the likelihood increases
> with time and use. That's why we keep the several levels of backup
> mentioned above. But I doubt that archiving would provide any additional
> security against corruption.
>
> When you have time, Pat, review the archives of this newsgroup and you
> will see this question raised and answered many times.
>
> RC
> --
> R. C. White, CPA
> San Marcos, TX
> (Retired. No longer licensed to practice public accounting.)
> rc@grandecom.net
> Microsoft Windows MVP
> (Currently running Vista Ultimate x64)
>
>>I have never performed Year-end archiving of my Quicken data. I am unclear
>>as which data will carry forward and which will not. That's followed by
>>how do I access data that is not carried forward. From the help topic:
>>"Archive your data file if you want to continue using an unchanged version
>>of your current data file, and also create and store a separate file with
>>just last year's transactions." Since I have never archived, will Quicken
>>now create separate archive files of each year's data, or will it create
>>one file of all data excepting the rule in the quote?
>> I am raising this question because I have been told that files will
>> corrupt after several years of use. My file goes way back, perhaps 10 or
>> more years. So, I am concerned that something drastic is just around the
>> corner. I backup my file habitually. Are the backed up files subject to
>> corruption, too? What can be done if a file corrupts? My file has been
>> validated and super validated recently.
>> Scratching my head and sitting on pins and needles,
>> Pat
>



Posted by R. C. White on January 2, 2007, 12:31 pm
Please log in for more thread options
Hi, Pat.

> How does one know that a file is corrupted?

Well, I don't know any single answer to that question. If the file won't
load, or if I suddenly am worth a billion dollars, then something is wrong,
obviously! But if the corruption is more subtle, I might not realize it for
a long time - years, even. And I may have dozens of backups, all created
since the corruption happened and all similarly corrupted.

Fortunately, I haven't had any Quicken file corruption in several years (so
far as I know!). In the earlier years, using MS-DOS and DOS-based Windows
(Win3.x, Win9x) and FATx file systems, corruption was not unusual. I
haven't Validated my Quicken file since about January 2004, so far as I can
tell. That doesn't mean that I haven't made mistakes, of course. Just none
that made me worry that my fileset was corrupted.

Perhaps John Pollard has a more definitive answer for both of us.

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(Retired. No longer licensed to practice public accounting.)
rc@grandecom.net
Microsoft Windows MVP
(Currently running Vista Ultimate x64)

> Thanks RC for a very informative response.
>
> Perhaps you can answer this question. How does one know that a file is
> corrupted? After several hours of work by a skilled and gifted support
> agent at Schwab, he said that my file is corrupt. I begged to differ with
> him because the resolution of my problem did not set well with me. After
> much deliberation, I went back to one of my backup files and began
> replicating in it the changes he had made. The file seems to work well.
> Thanks,
> Pat
>> Hi, Pat.
>>
>> This is one of the most-often-discussed issues in this newsgroup,
>> especially around the end of each year.
>>
>> The short answer is that most of us agree that backups are great, but
>> archiving is not needed and will reduce the usefulness of Quicken.
>>
>> Backups, especially at "milestone" points, such as the end of each year,
>> are excellent ideas. In addition to the regular weekly backups which
>> Quicken makes automatically, plus the "manual" backups that Q reminds us
>> to do frequently, it is a great idea to have a backup of your data as of
>> last year-end, and that it is on removable media of some kind that can be
>> stored separately from your computer in case of fire, theft or other
>> disaster.
>>
>> But most of us see little good in removing historic data from our Quicken
>> data fileset. Yes, it makes the file smaller so that it takes up less
>> disk space. Many feel that it makes Q load faster, but nobody has ever
>> proven that, so far as I know, or even quantified it here. We often
>> discuss the size of our various Q data filesets, and many are larger and
>> go back further than yours. I've been using Quicken since 1990 and my
>> fileset (the .qdf plus .idx, .qph and 4 others) totals just over 30 MB.
>> On a 120 GB hard drive, even multiple backups of that size are not a
>> great burden. Others have reported larger files than that without any
>> problems in loading or using Quicken.
>>
>> The beauty of this is that I can load Q2007 Basic and get a report of my
>> income and/or expenses for 1992 or 2002 as easily and quickly as for
>> 2006. If I need to recall when I bought that computer printer that went
>> bad, to see if it is out of warranty, it takes me only seconds. I don't
>> have to recall which year it might have happened, then find that year's
>> archive, load it, read it -- and then go look for the years before and
>> after until I find the right one. (And trying to find a 5.25" floppy
>> disk drive to read my old 1990 archive?)
>>
>>> I am raising this question because I have been told that files will
>>> corrupt after several years of use.
>>
>> Yes, we often hear that users "have been told" this, anonymously, of
>> course, but our own experience tells us otherwise. Yes, corruption was
>> certainly a problem a dozen years ago. Floppy diskettes were notorious
>> and early 20 MB hard drives were not much better. I still click Backup
>> several times in each Quicken session, a habit that goes back to the time
>> when spontaneous resets and other computer glitches left me looking at a
>> rebooting computer and having to re-enter an hour's work, not just in Q
>> but in Word and any other application I might have been using. Today's
>> computers, though, including the hard drives (and the NTFS file system)
>> are so reliable that such a situation rarely occurs. File corruption is
>> not inevitable, though, and like anything else, the likelihood increases
>> with time and use. That's why we keep the several levels of backup
>> mentioned above. But I doubt that archiving would provide any additional
>> security against corruption.
>>
>> When you have time, Pat, review the archives of this newsgroup and you
>> will see this question raised and answered many times.
>>
>> RC
>>
>>>I have never performed Year-end archiving of my Quicken data. I am
>>>unclear as which data will carry forward and which will not. That's
>>>followed by how do I access data that is not carried forward. From the
>>>help topic: "Archive your data file if you want to continue using an
>>>unchanged version of your current data file, and also create and store a
>>>separate file with just last year's transactions." Since I have never
>>>archived, will Quicken now create separate archive files of each year's
>>>data, or will it create one file of all data excepting the rule in the
>>>quote?
>>> I am raising this question because I have been told that files will
>>> corrupt after several years of use. My file goes way back, perhaps 10
>>> or more years. So, I am concerned that something drastic is just around
>>> the corner. I backup my file habitually. Are the backed up files subject
>>> to corruption, too? What can be done if a file corrupts? My file has
>>> been validated and super validated recently.
>>> Scratching my head and sitting on pins and needles,
>>> Pat


Posted by John Pollard on January 2, 2007, 1:21 pm
Please log in for more thread options
R. C. White wrote:
> Hi, Pat.

>> How does one know that a file is corrupted?

> Well, I don't know any single answer to that question. If the
> file won't load, or if I suddenly am worth a
> billion dollars, then something is wrong, obviously! But
> if the corruption is more subtle, I might not realize it
> for a long time - years, even. And I may have dozens of
> backups, all created since the corruption happened and
> all similarly corrupted.
> Fortunately, I haven't had any Quicken file corruption in
> several years (so far as I know!). In the earlier years,
> using MS-DOS and DOS-based Windows (Win3.x, Win9x) and
> FATx file systems, corruption was not unusual. I haven't
> Validated my Quicken file since about January 2004, so
> far as I can tell. That doesn't mean that I haven't made
> mistakes, of course. Just none that made me worry that
> my fileset was corrupted.
> Perhaps John Pollard has a more definitive answer for
> both of us.

I can't really improve on your answer, RC.

I do know that there are some problems/errors that occur in
Quicken which Intuit believes are nearly always (very
frequently?) caused by file corruption ... but the only way I
know that is when I lookup a problem at the Intuit Support site
(or possibly when an Intuit employee posts such info in the
Quicken forums). My fading memory tells me there are quite a
few Quicken problems that are considered likely to be caused by
corruption ... but that memory isn't good enough to remember
what specific problems they are.

R. C. White wrote:
> Hi, Pat.

>> How does one know that a file is corrupted?

> Well, I don't know any single answer to that question. If the
> file won't load, or if I suddenly am worth a
> billion dollars, then something is wrong, obviously! But
> if the corruption is more subtle, I might not realize it
> for a long time - years, even. And I may have dozens of
> backups, all created since the corruption happened and
> all similarly corrupted.
> Fortunately, I haven't had any Quicken file corruption in
> several years (so far as I know!). In the earlier years,
> using MS-DOS and DOS-based Windows (Win3.x, Win9x) and
> FATx file systems, corruption was not unusual. I haven't
> Validated my Quicken file since about January 2004, so
> far as I can tell. That doesn't mean that I haven't made
> mistakes, of course. Just none that made me worry that
> my fileset was corrupted.
> Perhaps John Pollard has a more definitive answer for
> both of us.

I can't really improve on your answer, RC.

I do know that there are some problems/errors that occur in
Quicken which Intuit believes are nearly always (very
frequently?) caused by file corruption ... but the only way I
know that is when I lookup a problem at the Intuit Support site
(or possibly when an Intuit employee posts such info in the
Quicken forums). My fading memory tells me there are quite a
few Quicken problems that are considered likely to be caused by
corruption ... but that memory isn't good enough to remember
what specific problems they are.

On a personal level, I get some sort of educated-gut-feeling
that sometimes I am seeing - or hearing about - something that
may likely be the result of corruption. But the last time I
thought my data was corrupt neither Validate nor Intuit's data
analysis/repair team could find any corruption. I reinstalled
Quicken and most of my problem went away. So much for
"educated-gut-feelings".

There are two basic ways to catch much of any corruption that
might be present: both of which are fairly easy to do and which
pose little or no risk. Validating a Quicken copy of the data
will catch corruption much of the time, especially
non-investment account corruption. And a rename of the price
history file should catch all price history corruption.

--
John Pollard
First initial underscore Last name at mchsi dot com
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