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Posted by Mark Bole on February 21, 2008, 7:42 am
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John A. Weeks III wrote:
>
>> My dad actually physically lives in New York City. BUT: _every_ "address"
>> for him is to my place, in Virginia. [e.g., his bank accounts are here,
>> all his bills and such are sent here, all of his mail comes here, his assets
>> are
>> registered at my address]. Is he still considered a resident of NYS?
>> [first,
>> for legal matters, and second for taxes: would he still have to pay NYS/NYC
>> taxes? VA taxes? (heavenforfend, both..:o)) Where would he vote? in NYS or
>> absentee ballot in VA?]
>
[...]
> Banking used to be a factor, but with electronic banking in past
> years and Internet today, you can open a bank account just about
> anywhere.
True, but you can still only visit a physical ATM and walk into a
physical bank lobby with physical tellers at a specific physical
location, and those transactions are recorded (physically...).
-Mark Bole
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Posted by Mike on February 22, 2008, 7:26 am
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Mark Bole wrote:
> John A. Weeks III wrote:
>>
>>> My dad actually physically lives in New York City. BUT: _every_ "address"
>>> for him is to my place, in Virginia. [e.g., his bank accounts are here,
>>> all his bills and such are sent here, all of his mail comes here, his assets
>>> are
>>> registered at my address]. Is he still considered a resident of NYS?
>>> [first,
>>> for legal matters, and second for taxes: would he still have to pay NYS/NYC
>>> taxes? VA taxes? (heavenforfend, both..:o)) Where would he vote? in NYS or
>>> absentee ballot in VA?]
>
> [...]
>> Banking used to be a factor, but with electronic banking in past
>> years and Internet today, you can open a bank account just about
>> anywhere.
>
> True, but you can still only visit a physical ATM and walk into a
> physical bank lobby with physical tellers at a specific physical
> location, and those transactions are recorded (physically...).
But that wouldn't show where you lived. I could live in Florida and yet
fly to NY every morning on business, got to an ATM or a bank and get
cash for the strippers (er, I mean the entertainment hostesses at the
business meeting<g>) and then fly back each evening and never sleep in
NY at all.
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Posted by Katie on February 23, 2008, 7:33 am
Please log in for more thread options > > [...]
> >> Banking used to be a factor, but with electronic banking in past
> >> years and Internet today, you can open a bank account just about
> >> anywhere.
>
> > True, but you can still only visit a physical ATM and walk into a
> > physical bank lobby with physical tellers at a specific physical
> > location, and those transactions are recorded (physically...).
>
> But that wouldn't show where you lived. I could live in Florida and yet
> fly to NY every morning on business, got to an ATM or a bank and get
> cash for the strippers (er, I mean the entertainment hostesses at the
> business meeting<g>) and then fly back each evening and never sleep in
> NY at all.-
But if you didn't maintain a permanent place of abode in NY, you would
not be a NY resident even if you were there every day. If your
domicile is outside NY, you are a nonresident unless you BOTH maintain
a permanent place of abode AND spend more than 183 days of the taxable
year there.
Of course if you work in NY, you would have NY source income that
would be subject to state income tax. The NYC income tax applies only
to residents (and the city definition of a resident is the same as the
state's).
With respect to the OP's father, if he was a VA domiciliary (or
domiciled in any state other than NY) before he went into the NY
nursing home, whether he is a NY resident as a result of his stay
there depends on whether he is incompetent. There are NY cases
holding that a person whose presence in NY is involuntary, such as an
incompetent person (e.g., an Alzheimer's patient), is not a resident
by virtue of being in a NY nursing home. And vice versa: a NY
domiciliary who is incompetent and is in a nursing home in another
state does not become a nonresident. The reason is that a "permanent
place of abode" is a place that is chosen voluntarily by the
taxpayer. (Richard I. Furman.) New York Advisory Opinion TSB-
A-06(6)I, 08/28/2006; Ratkowsky v. Browne (1944) 47 NYS2d 905 , 267 AD
643 .
If the OP's father is domiciled in VA (or elsewhere) and is not
incompetent, the nursing home is a permanent place of abode unless he
is there for a temporary purpose, such as to recover from surgery,
that can reasonably be expected to take a limited amount of time. If
he expects to be there for the long term, he is a resident.
If the OP's father was domiciled in NY before he went into the nursing
home, he remains a NY domiciliary and a NY resident. He is not a
resident of VA under any test, since he is not domiciled there and has
not been present there. Having his son take care of his financial
affairs in VA does not make him a resident.
Katie in San Diego
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Posted by Dick Adams on February 19, 2008, 7:04 am
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> My dad actually physically lives in New York City.
> BUT: _every_ " address" for him is to my place, in
> Virginia. [e.g., his bank accounts are here, all
> his bills and such are sent here, all of his mail
> comes here, his assets are registered at my address].
> Is he still considered a resident of NYS? [first,
> for legal matters, and second for taxes: would he
> still have to pay NYS/NYC taxes? VA taxes?
> (heavenforfend, both..:o)) Where would he vote?
> in NYS or absentee ballot in VA?]
Does he have earned income or is he retired?
That doesn't matter - just interested in more
detail,
Depending on where you live and where you work,
you either pay your taxes where you live or
where you work or sometimes both. NYC is one
of those places where you may have to pay in
both places.
Without more information, it appears to me
that he has to pay NYC and NYS taxes, but
not VA taxes since he has no nexus in VA
other than a son doing his recordkeeping.
Run the numbers to see how much less he'd pay
if he moved to VA.
Also he should be voting in NYC.
Dick
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Posted by nospam on February 19, 2008, 7:04 am
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> My dad actually physically lives in New York City.
> BUT: _every_ "address" for him is to my place,
> in Virginia. [e.g., his bank accounts are here,
> all his bills and such are sent here, all of his
> mail comes here, his assets are registered at
> my address]. Is he still considered a resident
> of NYS? [first, for legal matters, and second
> for taxes: would he still have to pay NYS/NYC
> taxes? VA taxes? (heavenforfend, both..:o))
> Where would he vote? in NYS or absentee
> ballot in VA?]
Except that you are correct to note, as you do at least implicitly,
that "resident" and "residence" are accorded different law significant
meanings depending on the particular context/purposes in/for which
those words are used, even if you did not say (though you did) that
your father "actually" [sic] resides in New York City, surrounding the
word "address" to which you refer in Va. where you reside ("[your]
address") with quotation marks appears to suggest (at least
unless/until you fact-specifically describe otherwise) that your
father neither resides in Va. nor treats Va. as his "domicile" (for
any N.Y. law purposes) because you do not say, with respect to the
latter issue, that he intended at any time in the past or presently
intends to treat Va. as his permanent residence.
To the contrary, the most you so far appear to say in this connection
is that he has been using "[your] address" as a mail drop -- no less,
but also (for, "Where does he 'reside' and where is he 'domiciled'?"
purposes) no more.
Apart from you not having said that your father during whatever (also
not actually here identified) period you have in mind has resided or
has been or plans ever to be domiciled in Va. or has conducted any
business in/by/through which he generated any income in Va., so that
one cannot answer reliably solely on the basis of the facts you so far
state whether he would/wouldn't have any income tax liability to Va.,
if you mean by "actually physically lives in New York City" that your
father has maintained a permanent apartment or other abode there at
which he has spent an aggregate of more than one-hundred eighty-three
days during each to you relevant year in New York state and city, then
he is a "resident individual" for the purposes of being obliged to
report and, if relevant/applicable, o pay New York State and New York
City income taxes (re. which, see/read N.Y. Tax Law § 605(b) and
N.Y.C. Administrative Code § 11-1705[b] [which mirrors the said state
tax law provision]).
For background discussion/analysis for New York income tax purposes
(including a discussion of "double taxation" issues if they are
relevant to you), perhaps the presently most dispositive case law
source worth reading (there are hundreds of reported and unreported
decisions dealing with state straddling individuals raising these
issues) is In re Tamagni, 91 N.Y.2d 530, 673 N.Y.S.2d 44, 695 N.E.2d
1125 (1998) which is also discussed/glossed in later such cases.
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