Home Page link  

Is this an installment sale?

 

Taxes General Forum - Tax professionals meeting place and answers to queries. (Moderated) 

get this group's latest topics as an RSS feed add this group's latest topics to your My MSN content add this group's latest topics to your My Yahoo content  add this group's latest topics to your Google content  YahooMyWeb Yahoo!  Google Google  Windows Live Favorites Windows Live  del.icio.us del.icio.us  digg digg  Add to Netscape Netscape
Subject Author Date
Is this an installment sale? Kevin 05-21-2009
  |--> Re: Is this an installment sale? removeps-groups@yahoo.com06-11-2009
  |     `--> Re: Is this an installment sale? Gene E. Utterback, EA, RF...05-27-2009
  | `--> Re: Is this an installment sale? Gene E. Utterback, EA, RF...05-28-2009
  |--> Re: Is this an installment sale? removeps-groups@yahoo.com06-10-2009
Posted by Kevin on May 21, 2009, 11:36 am
Please log in for more thread options
I just sold my business. There is an ongoing lawsuit against the business,
and part of the money paid to me was deposited in an escrow account to pay
for any award. Under the sale contract I am responsible for declaring any
income on the account on my tax return, and I get whatever is left after the
suit concludes. It will certainly be a couple years. The purchaser is
responsible for defending the suit as it is now against him, but I get to
approve anything they do.

My lawyer and accountant disagree over whether it is an installment sale.
The accountant says that I was paid everything this year and the money in
the escrow account is mine, so why would it be an installment sale? Since
the amount I am going to ultimately get is unknown, it can't be an
installment sale.
The lawyer can't put his finger on a comparable case, but feels the IRS will
insist the escrow dissolution is a second payment and that makes it an
installment sale; despite the fact that the contract clearly wasn't intended
to be one. He recommends that I treat it as an installment sale now to
avoid hassles with the IRS.

The only thing at stake (please let me know if you don't agree with this) is
whether there is imputed interest or not. My taxes will go up a little if
there is because it changes capital gains to interest (my basis is nearly
zero), but the purchaser's taxes will go down significantly as they would
get to deduct the imputed interest. Seems to me the IRS would rather it not
be an installment sale, but the lawyer says they aren't that farsighted.

So what do you think? Is there anything definitive on this. Seems to me I
am risking trouble either way unless there is.

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
<< >>
<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
<< are at www.asktax.org. >>
<< Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. >>
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>

Posted by Alan on May 21, 2009, 12:01 pm
Please log in for more thread options
Kevin wrote:
> I just sold my business. There is an ongoing lawsuit against the business,
> and part of the money paid to me was deposited in an escrow account to pay
> for any award. Under the sale contract I am responsible for declaring any
> income on the account on my tax return, and I get whatever is left after the
> suit concludes. It will certainly be a couple years. The purchaser is
> responsible for defending the suit as it is now against him, but I get to
> approve anything they do.
>
> My lawyer and accountant disagree over whether it is an installment sale.
> The accountant says that I was paid everything this year and the money in
> the escrow account is mine, so why would it be an installment sale? Since
> the amount I am going to ultimately get is unknown, it can't be an
> installment sale.
> The lawyer can't put his finger on a comparable case, but feels the IRS will
> insist the escrow dissolution is a second payment and that makes it an
> installment sale; despite the fact that the contract clearly wasn't intended
> to be one. He recommends that I treat it as an installment sale now to
> avoid hassles with the IRS.
>
> The only thing at stake (please let me know if you don't agree with this) is
> whether there is imputed interest or not. My taxes will go up a little if
> there is because it changes capital gains to interest (my basis is nearly
> zero), but the purchaser's taxes will go down significantly as they would
> get to deduct the imputed interest. Seems to me the IRS would rather it not
> be an installment sale, but the lawyer says they aren't that farsighted.
>
> So what do you think? Is there anything definitive on this. Seems to me I
> am risking trouble either way unless there is.
>
Accountant is right. Lawyer is wrong. Besides, when you report
the total sale in 2009 and do not file Form 6252, you have
elected out of an installment sale.

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
<< >>
<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
<< are at www.asktax.org. >>
<< Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. >>
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>

Posted by Kevin on May 21, 2009, 2:03 pm
Please log in for more thread options

> Accountant is right. Lawyer is wrong. Besides, when you report
> the total sale in 2009 and do not file Form 6252, you have elected out of
> an installment sale.
>
No, I didn't file a 6252, but the lawyer thinks the IRS will demand I treat
it as an installment sale anyhow so they can tax the imputed interest.

I would like the accountant to be right, but do you have a code section, a
case, or a line of reasoning to support him?

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
<< >>
<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
<< are at www.asktax.org. >>
<< Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. >>
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>

Posted by Seth on May 21, 2009, 3:00 pm
Please log in for more thread options
>
>> Accountant is right. Lawyer is wrong. Besides, when you report
>> the total sale in 2009 and do not file Form 6252, you have elected out of
>> an installment sale.
>>
>No, I didn't file a 6252, but the lawyer thinks the IRS will demand I treat
>it as an installment sale anyhow so they can tax the imputed interest.

What do you mean "imputed interest"? Isn't the excrow account earning
real interest?

Seth

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
<< >>
<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
<< are at www.asktax.org. >>
<< Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. >>
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>

Posted by Alan on May 21, 2009, 3:49 pm
Please log in for more thread options
Kevin wrote:
>> Accountant is right. Lawyer is wrong. Besides, when you report
>> the total sale in 2009 and do not file Form 6252, you have elected out of
>> an installment sale.
>>
> No, I didn't file a 6252, but the lawyer thinks the IRS will demand I treat
> it as an installment sale anyhow so they can tax the imputed interest.
>
> I would like the accountant to be right, but do you have a code section, a
> case, or a line of reasoning to support him?
>
1. You don't have a contract calling for payment over more than
one tax year.
2. You said you received full payment. The escrow account is
yours and merely exists for contingencies.
3. A taxpayer elects out of an installment sale by not filing
Form 6252 and reporting the total gain on the proper form or
schedule.

What I am trying to tell you is that even if your lawyer is right
and the accountant and I am wrong, it doesn't matter if you elect
out.

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
<< >>
<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
<< are at www.asktax.org. >>
<< Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. >>
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>

Similar ThreadsPosted
Installment sale/imputed interest August 12, 2009, 12:53 pm
New installment agreement after default? June 20, 2006, 2:12 am
Can taxpayer revoke installment agreement? May 22, 2008, 11:28 am
interest on installment purchase of s-corp June 5, 2008, 11:24 pm
Imputed interest on installment sales October 7, 2009, 3:15 pm
File for extension or request installment agreement, which is better? April 10, 2008, 6:03 pm
six month extension with an existing installment agreement March 13, 2009, 3:47 pm
IRS Announces Installment Agreement User Fee Increases for Some Taxpayer December 29, 2006, 8:52 pm
Married couple earning ~$31,100/year with just over $25,000 in IRS liabilities - installment agreement or OIC? September 12, 2008, 10:45 am
PTP Sale March 17, 2009, 8:29 am

Contact Us | Privacy Policy
This site is not affiliated with Intuit - makers of Quickbooks and Quicken software
This site is not affiliated with Sage Software - makers of Peachtree accounting software
XML SitemapXML Sitemap