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Sold Car / Paid Off Loan - Is it really an asset when car loan present?

 

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Sold Car / Paid Off Loan - Is it really an asset when car loan present? Justin 02-02-2007
Posted by Katie on February 2, 2007, 8:15 pm
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> I'm deducting mileage on form 2106. I'm a traveling music
> teacher, I commute to an office and from there am sent to
> various places to teach.
>
> It is my understanding that my mileage accrued during the
> work day (after arriving at the office) is deductible. I
> travel 30,000 miles a year during the workday outside of my
> commute to the office. This adds up to a very sizeable
> deduction. I am no reimbursed for any travel expenses except
> tolls.
>
> The car I use is for both business and personal, with only
> about 10,000 miles a year being for personal. I sold the car
> this year and bought another car. Turbotax is taking the
> $4000 I sold the car for and counting as income, which is
> reducing my refund by over $600. I owed $4500 on the car
> when I sold it for $4000. It is not like this money was
> "profit" or "free and clear".
>
> Form 2106 is clear cut and says "Date Vehicle Sold" and
> "Sale Price". After entering these fields, Turbotax reduces
> over $600 in my rebate. It never asks wether there was a car
> loan?
>
> If it matters, I do not depreciate the car as an asset. I
> just take the mileage deduction each year.
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks.

Somewhere TT must ask for your basis in the car, which is
the amount you originally paid for it, less any allowed or
allowable depreciation. Since you have always claimed the
mileage allowance, I don't think you need to take any
depreciation into account. The balance due on the loan is
irrelevant. The gain or loss on the sale of the car is the
amount you received for it, minus what you paid for it.
That's almost certainly a loss. Since you did not treat the
car as a business asset, it's a personal loss and not
deductible.

Katie in San Diego

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Posted by Bill Brown on February 3, 2007, 2:33 am
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To reiterate what Paul Thomas and I said, the standard
mileage rate includes a component for depreciation that
reduces the owner's basis in the automobile. If business use
is great enough, the owner can easily have a gain on
disposal of that care.

Wile Coyote mentioned the possibility of a like-kind
exchange. That requires the taxpayer to have traded the car
in a partial payment for a new car, and not "sold the car
this year and bought another car."

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Posted by Shyster1040 on February 4, 2007, 2:25 am
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Just to correct my earlier post - unfortunately I passed
over the part about the OP taking the standard mileage
deduction without taking that fact into account in my
answer.

As a result, you have already claimed depreciation on the
car because the standard mileage deduction includes
depreciation. In addition, the standard mileage deduction
effectively permits you to depreciate that part of the cost
of the car that would ordinarily be nondepreciable because
it represented the "part" of the car used for personal use.

However, the amount of depreciation that was included in the
standard mileage deduction you took varied from year to year,
so you should do the actual calculations to see what result
you get. To see an example, see IRS Pub. 463, available at:
http://www.irs.gov/publications/p463

<< ======================================================= >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
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<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
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<< Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. >>
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Posted by Victor Roberts on February 8, 2007, 8:17 am
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> To reiterate what Paul Thomas and I said, the standard
> mileage rate includes a component for depreciation that
> reduces the owner's basis in the automobile. If business use
> is great enough, the owner can easily have a gain on
> disposal of that care.
>
> Wile Coyote mentioned the possibility of a like-kind
> exchange. That requires the taxpayer to have traded the car
> in a partial payment for a new car, and not "sold the car
> this year and bought another car."

I'm not one of the many tax pros here but this whole
discussion conflicts with my meager understanding of Pub
463. If the OP used the Standard Mileage Rate for a car she
owned then it seems that the sale of the car is not relevant
to her business taxes at all. She must have entered
something incorrectly into TurboTax.

--
Vic Roberts
Replace xxx with vdr in e-mail address.

<< ======================================================= >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
<< >>
<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
<< are at www.asktax.org. >>
<< Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. >>
<< ======================================================= >>

Posted by Shyster1040 on February 9, 2007, 12:49 am
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You're missing the main point. If the car was solely used
for personal use, the OP could not have taken any deductions
for it, not actual expenses and depreciation, nor as an
alternative the standard mileage rate. Since she did use it
3/4 for business-use, and since she did take the standard
mileage deduction, it necessarily relates to her business
affairs.

Second, since it was used in her business, when she sells
the car she must recapture any depreciation she took, either
directly or indirectly via the standard mileage deduction,
to the extent of the lesser of her gain or the amount of
depreciation allowed.

In this case, based on the mileage figures the OP stated,
the cost basis of the car has probably been reduced to $0 by
now (although that will depend on how long she had the car,
used it for business, and how much she originally paid for
it).

As a result, unless she traded the car in for a new car, in
which case the like-kind exchange rules will apply, most or
all of the $4,000 she received on sale of the car would
represent recaptured depreciation and, as a result, would be
treated as ordinary taxable income in the year of receipt.

<< ======================================================= >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
<< >>
<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
<< are at www.asktax.org. >>
<< Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. >>
<< ======================================================= >>

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