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wash sale Qs

 

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Subject Author Date
wash sale Qs Alexei A. Frounze 04-09-2008
---> Re: wash sale Qs Barry Margolin04-09-2008
`--> Re: wash sale Qs removeps-groups...04-10-2008
Posted by Phil Marti on April 10, 2008, 2:37 pm
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"Seth" wrote:

>>The history of how your basis was established is irrelevant. Any time you
>>sell for a loss you have to consider the wash sale rule if:
>>
>>1. You still have a holding in the security after the sale; or
>
> Huh? Selling half a position has the same rule as selling all of it.

You're so intent on making this harder than it is that you're not paying
attention. If after a sale you hold no shares of the stock just sold, the
wash sale rule cannot apply unless...

>>2. You purchase the same security within 30 days after the sale.
>
> Shouldn't that be "within 30 days before or after" and remove rule 1?

No, since I already dealt with the before part in number 1. If you buy
something and within 30 days sell it for a loss but hold no remaining shares
of the stock (my # 1), the wash sale rule doesn't apply, unless #2 applies.

--
Phil Marti
Clarksburg, MD

--
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Posted by Barry Margolin on April 10, 2008, 6:35 pm
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In article

> > In article
> >
> > > Q2: If I adjust (reduce) the basis of some stock due to a wash sale,
> >
> > You never reduce the basis. The disallowed loss is added to the basis
> > of the replacement shares, so you increase the basis.
> >
> > > then it may happen that for that stock the adjusted basis is less than
> > > the proceeds and so, the loss has just moved to a different place. And
> >
> > If the basis is less than the proceeds, you have a GAIN, not a loss.
> > What I think you means to say is that it may happen that the increased
> > basis is greater than the proceeds.
>
> Sorry, you're right, I increase the basis, of course.
>
> > > this is asking to apply the wash sale rules again and again and again,
> > > until the loss is fully absorbed by the gains or there's no way to
> > > absorb it entirely (all wash sale rules exhausted) and it stays as a
> > > loss at which point some other rules may come in play (i.e. if it's a
> > > net loss there're limits on how much can be claimed). Did I get it
> > > right that after I've moved a loss to a different place (having
> > > applied the wash sale rules) I need to look again if that newly
> > > created loss may cause further wash sale adjustments?
> >
> > I'm not really sure what you're getting at. You have to make another
> > sale to have another wash sale.
>
> So, if the shares whose basis was adjusted due to the wash sale rules
> were sold, then what? If selling them with this adjusted basis results
> in a loss (but wouldn't if I had not made the adjustment), then I need
> to check whether or not that results in another wash sale? Right?

Yes. Once you make the adjustment, you use the adjusted basis and
purchase date when figuring out whether any future sales are wash sales.

You might want to take a look at http://www.fairmark.com/capgain/wash.
It has lots of information on the wash sale rule, including links to
software that can help if you have lots of trades that need to be
reconciled.

--
Barry Margolin, barmar@alum.mit.edu
Arlington, MA
*** PLEASE don't copy me on replies, I'll read them in the group ***

--
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<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
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<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
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Posted by removeps-groups@yahoo.com on April 10, 2008, 11:07 am
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> Case 1:
> Xb ... [ ... Yb ... Xs ... ]
> Case 2:
> Xb ... [... Xs ... Yb ... ]
> Case 3:
> [... Ya ... Xb ... Xs ... ]
> Case 4:
> [... Xb ... Yb ... Xs ... ]
> Case 5:
> [... Xb ... Xs ... Yb ... ]

In addition to the other posts, were Xb and Xs and Yb the same number
of shares? If Xb and Xs were 10 shares, and Yb was 1 share, then the
disallowed loss in Xs is only for 1 share. If Yb was 10 or more,
then the disallowed loss is for all 10 shares (that is, none of the
loss is allowed).


> So, if I need to adjust Y's basis due to thewashsale, I also need to
> adjust Y's purchase date (cite from pub550:"If your loss was
> disallowed because of thewashsalerules, add the disallowed loss to
> the cost of the new stock or securities. The result is your basis in
> the new stock or securities. This adjustment postpones the loss
> deduction until the disposition of the new stock or securities. Your
> holding period for the new stock or securities begins on the same day
> as the holding period of the stock or securities sold.") I basically
> want to confirm that Yb may adjust into the past (cases 1,2,4,5) and
> into the future (case 3). If it's not how this is done, then how is
> it?
>
> Q2: If I adjust (reduce) the basis of some stock due to awashsale,
> then it may happen that for that stock the adjusted basis is less than
> the proceeds and so, the loss has just moved to a different place. And
> this is asking to apply thewashsalerules again and again and again,
> until the loss is fully absorbed by the gains or there's no way to
> absorb it entirely (allwashsalerules exhausted) and it stays as a
> loss at which point some other rules may come in play (i.e. if it's a
> net loss there're limits on how much can be claimed). Did I get it
> right that after I've moved a loss to a different place (having
> applied thewashsalerules) I need to look again if that newly
> created loss may cause furtherwashsaleadjustments?
>
> I've read pub 550 and the following, but it's still unclear what the
> new holding period (the date of acquire) should be and if thewashsalerules
apply
recursively:http://fairmark.com/capgain/wash/ws101.htmhttp://www.smartmoney.com/tax/capital/index.cfm?story=washruleshttp://www.armencomp.com/wash-sales.htmlhttp://www.armencomp.com/wash-sale-example.html

>
> Thanks,
> Alex

========================================= MODERATOR'S COMMENT:
Please delete unnecessary text from the prior message when posting.

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>
<< The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, >>
<< nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties >>
<< that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. >>
<< >>
<< The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts >>
<< to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy >>
<< are at www.asktax.org. >>
<< Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. >>
<< ------------------------------------------------------- >>

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